sorry separate post to rant

Yes grub2 is messier if you are used to grub legacy...no arguement.

Maybe my wiki was not clear in stating...grub2 does not like you editted its new config file....as changes are lost on every kernel upgrade or every grub2 upgrade.
This is because update-grub or update-grub2 is called on those events.
(update-grub2 merely links to update-grub)

And grub2 always ignore whats already in grub.cfg and instead calls every script including any you make up...from /etc/grub.d/

I prefer ppl to only use 40_custom because it is designed to be easy to modify.
/etc/default/grub is also easy to modify but that would normally be done once and then you forget it?

Unfortunately I am not a scripting expert. So I do not tamper much with the scripts in /etc.

edit

yes I agree "LEARNABILITY" is lacking in grub2.

regards
Back to top

speaking for myself, the documentation pages I linked to were fine for explaining the basics of grub2, but what is missing is a clear, readable, easy to follow comparison between config options of menu.lst and the various messy places grub 2 puts the stuff.

I would certainly not claim that menu.lst syntax was particularly clear or logical or intuitive, but at least it was static, simple config format.

If you want a real laugh, compare the method to set any one item as default:

default=save

then in the menu.lst entry, add:
savedefault
to the args.

Then see how you can try to emulate that simple command in grub 2, from what I can see, you can't do it at all, but they do have a very convoluted way to set the last selected option as next start up option, which is not the same thing at all.

Personally I plan on ignoring grub 2 though I did adapt smxi to handle it slightly so I don't have to jump in and adapt it when distros switch to it.

But the thing that is missing is the clear, side by side how to, using code/config samples, so people who suffered through learning the menu.lst syntax can at least try to use some of that learning.

I checked out some of the things over the last few days, and grub 2 is in terms of usability a total and complete failure, on all counts. Maybe someone will write a wrapper for it to let people actually use the tool, but as it is now, it's exclusive of all but a very small core of seriously addicted *nix users. Don't these types of linux/foss devs ever interact with normal humans, like, at the store or something? They have parents too, I assume, and siblings? Or not?
Back to top

hi

laughs about grub devs.

ok look I am not a dev so can afford to laugh.

-------

I do want to raise an issue about savedefault and unrelated hiddenmenu.

over the years at LQ answering (or attempting to) questions mainly from ms users....they get into trouble because some well known distros love savedefault.

Its a pain.

----

the trouble is this.

ms user gets a good grub legacy bootloader and related files for grub.
they then boot into ms
their distro does not warn them about the use of certain options.
If ms was their last option they then don't know how to get into linux
OR vice versa

coupled with a hiddenmenu so they do not know how to bring up the menu.
they then feel like a "mushroom" and thats how they have been treated by u-know-wat

-----
I am suggesting that grub legacy has poorly documented /low tips on how to NOT use hiddenmenu and savedefault.

-----

I ask ex-ms users to use
default (number)
and comment out hiddenmenu but change the timeout to 3 seconds which in the scheme of how slow they are to read or write is no great loss in booting time

---
I do take your comments seriously tho so will incrementally improve that comparison wiki page...but the guts of it is done


cheerio
Back to top

hi

its me hijacking the post again.

just added some new wiki pages

remaster a distro to make it a true grub2 rescue cd. I need to expand and provide examples but hopefully you catch my drift?
sidux.com/index.php?module=Wikula&tag=Grub2slit

and booting some hard drive isofiles (cd images)
sidux.com/index.php?module=Wikula&tag=Grub2isofrom

FYI in case you do not frequent the sidux forum or wikis

regards
Back to top

Thanks for the updated info aus9. So far I am getting along well with Grub2, but it is allways good to have some more info to rely on. Sidux is my main distro and I do follow all post on the sidux forums but i am reluctant to post anything there fearing someone will attack me......not a friendly place. I guess maybe I should not be talking about anoher forum here so if anyone is offended or if I am breaking the rules here I will edit this post and remove my comments.

I guess I missed it, what function does the script have ?

cheers,
BakUp
Back to top

BakUp

Which scipt are your referring to please?

regards
Back to top

Oh, maybe it wasn't anything, but you had posted this link:
sidux.com/index.php?module=Wikula&tag=Grub2isofrom

and down at the bottom of the page this is mentioned about a script:


I guess I didn't explain that very well.
Back to top

BakUp

That is the source script that I used to modify to create the grub2script. It is morally right to name the source file if you are modding it...as per GPL rules.

slh uses it...I presume to create isofrom menuentries for various development builds...to save him burning them....the same reason for us.

Altho if your burner fails...having the isofrom is always good.

regards
Back to top

Hi aus9, I am back again.

I am doing some testing with Grub2. I have 3 distros on one of my computers that use grub legacy and one that has Grub2.

In Grub2 terms:

Right now my grub boot menu is grub legacy booting from (hdo,2)

I have updated grub2 (update-grub2) on partition (hd0,1) it showed in the terminal that it gathered in the other three distro that were installed.

Now my question would be when I am booting up how do I get it to use the grub2 boot menu from the partition where my grub2 is located ?

I have always used The Grub-Super Disk for doing this task and has work well with grub legacy. But it appears it will not recognize grub2. Also the manual terminal way does not work for me, I tried the command from the (hd0,2) partition where grub2 is installed but it will not except the command "grub" or grub2.

Would you have any knowledge on how to complish this process ? I have done a lot of searching and reading but have drawn a blank.

Any comments or suggestions will be appreciated......

BakUp

< Edited by BakUp :: Oct 18, 09, 17:24 >
Back to top

hi

thanks for testing grub2.

As I understand it....grub legacy is in mbr of hd0.
grub legacy is chainloading to grub2.
You installed grub2 into the boot partition for hd0,2.

So in theory
sidux.com/index.php?module=Wikula&tag=Grub2Intro

boot into hd0,2....and open a terminal and su to root and run



Now if you already tried that and it failed...post the error messages.

Be aware my wiki has a new grub2 rescue cd...you may want to burn first...and study the ways to rescue grub2 back to grub-legacy.....and then you can try


Back to top